EVE Search - New drones, modules and what not

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 42 post(s)
Grey Area	Posted - 2005.11.03 09:12:00 - [1] 34 pages? Sheesh, I hope you will forgive me for not reading ALL of them... Quote from the blog; Now lets take a look at the Raven. It was limited to 6 drones due to it's small drone bay. As it is limited by it's drone bay size he can't carry any spare drones in his cargo hold. After the changes he would have room for 3 drones and their performance would depend on the Drone Interfacing skill giving him the max damage output the same as of 6 drones at Drone Interfacing level 5. I doubt that a lot of Raven pilots bothered to train Drone Interfacing to level 5 so this will probably be a bit of a damage reduction to them. ...re Raven's drone bay reduction...first thought was this is disastrous; fitting small turrets on to the Raven to deal with small fast targets has limited effectiveness. The Raven is not a turret ship and so gets no bonus to their use whatsoever. Most Raven pilots rely on drones to finish them off. Now to do that we have to train ANOTHER skill, on top of the 17 million skill points we had to invest in missiles, just to get our DPS back to about 90% of where it used to be pre-patch. However, this post introduces webbing and target painting drones...I'll have to try the changes for real to see how much of an advantage they are...it may be a better idea now to choose those and fit turrets again. NOT keen on the idea of the EWAR drones at all. From my limited experience of PVP, EWAR really IS the "I win" button, and I think the drones with their no cap/no cpu/no powergrid fiotting requirements are just too powerful to be throwing this stuff around. ========================================= * I'm ALLOWED to cheat. I'm a STARSHIP. * =========================================
Grey Area Caldari	Posted - 2005.11.03 09:12:00 - [2] 34 pages? Sheesh, I hope you will forgive me for not reading ALL of them... Quote from the blog; Now lets take a look at the Raven. It was limited to 6 drones due to it's small drone bay. As it is limited by it's drone bay size he can't carry any spare drones in his cargo hold. After the changes he would have room for 3 drones and their performance would depend on the Drone Interfacing skill giving him the max damage output the same as of 6 drones at Drone Interfacing level 5. I doubt that a lot of Raven pilots bothered to train Drone Interfacing to level 5 so this will probably be a bit of a damage reduction to them. ...re Raven's drone bay reduction...first thought was this is disastrous; fitting small turrets on to the Raven to deal with small fast targets has limited effectiveness. The Raven is not a turret ship and so gets no bonus to their use whatsoever. Most Raven pilots rely on drones to finish them off. Now to do that we have to train ANOTHER skill, on top of the 17 million skill points we had to invest in missiles, just to get our DPS back to about 90% of where it used to be pre-patch. However, this post introduces webbing and target painting drones...I'll have to try the changes for real to see how much of an advantage they are...it may be a better idea now to choose those and fit turrets again. NOT keen on the idea of the EWAR drones at all. From my limited experience of PVP, EWAR really IS the "I win" button, and I think the drones with their no cap/no cpu/no powergrid fiotting requirements are just too powerful to be throwing this stuff around. --- I don't mind you disagreeing with me. Just don't say I don't have the SKILLS to comment.
Grey Area	Posted - 2005.11.03 09:16:00 - [3] Just wondering...ships that get an ECM bonus (Scorp)...will they get any sort of bonus to ECM drone effects? ========================================= * I'm ALLOWED to cheat. I'm a STARSHIP. * =========================================
Grey Area Caldari	Posted - 2005.11.03 09:16:00 - [4] Just wondering...ships that get an ECM bonus (Scorp)...will they get any sort of bonus to ECM drone effects? --- I don't mind you disagreeing with me. Just don't say I don't have the SKILLS to comment.
Grey Area	Posted - 2005.11.12 16:09:00 - [5] This is a crosspost from another thread...corssposting is baad, m'kay? But in this case I think it needs to be seen here. I've added a bit more info, so it's not just a plain copy/paste job. Originally by: Liu Kaskakka Everyone has drone interfacing lvl 5 already anyway so it doesn't matter. Originally by: Weirda not saying its not a nerf... but why 'raven'? Let me explain. The old Drone Interfacing skill allowed you to control one extra drone from the top end of "drones" skill...so increasing it from 5 through to ten. The drone bay on most non-Gallente ships will hold SIX heavy drones. As Heavies are pound for pound better than anything smaller, most non-Gallente just train DI to level 1...that gives you enough to control all 6 heavy drones. Training it any higher is pointless as you can't carry any more drones than that. So firstly, assuming an equal spread of the four races, I would guess only 25% have DI to anything like level 5. Secondly, since the missile patch, use of drones is more essential to a Raven pilot than it is to an Apoc or Tempest pilot...let me back this up. First, turrets have no travel time. So against a small target, they hit as soon as it is locked. To travel 100km, Cruise takes 12 seconds, Torps nearly 20, and ROF is about 8 seconds in the best case. An Interceptor doing 4000m/s has closed the distance down to less than 50km in that space of time, so the Raven pilot gets in maybe TWO volleys before the Interceptor is on top of him...the volleys are effectively fixed damage (and work out to about 40 points per missile BEFORE resistances are applied). This basically means the Interceptor arrives at the Raven almost 100% intact...which means the drones have to do all the work taking him down. Now a Turret BS...first off the Interceptor pilot has a choice...go straight in and get hit, or keep transversal high and not get hit (or at least, get hit a lot less). Most large guns will be able to get 5 or 6 volleys in EVEN IF THE INTERCEPTOR HEADS STRAIGHT IN. So the Interceptor pilot (if he knows his stuff) has to choose to be careful. Even then, the random nature of turrets, and careful timing (here's a hint, if you're in a Turret BS being approached by an Inty, use the "Look at" command to watch your target...opportunities for good shots arise...you'll figure it out) results in the Interceptor arriving at the target BS in a MORE damaged state, and at a later time than if it had approached a Raven...thus, less work for the drones to do. Also...The Apoc has eight turret slots, so the two turrets it has fitted will benefit from all the "generic" gunnery skills that the Apoc pilot undoubtedly has...surgical strike, Motion Prediction etc. The Tempest is a flat four:four ship, so doesn't favour any particular type of weapon (to be honest, I always felt sorry for the Minmatar about this). However, it DOES give the Minmatar pilot the option of fitting for smaller targets by putting on either small launchers or small turrets, according to whichever he is most skilled in. The Raven however, is a missile boat...however, it is a missile boat with only 6 missile slots, so Raven pilots are using turrets for close in defence which they likely have lower than average skills in. Admittedly, training a small turret skill up to level 5 is no big deal...but all the other "generic" gunnery skills are. So... Apoc pilot fits small energy weapons and benefits from generic gunnery skills Tempest pilot can fit either small guns or small launchers, depending in which skills he has more points. Raven pilot is forced to use small turrets in which he is likely to be low skilled. All of which forces even MORE of the work to be done on to the drones. Put simply, of all the non-Gallente BS, the Raven is the MOST reliant on its drones, and that is why we regard this as another Raven nerf. I hope that's cleared things up. ========================================= * I'm ALLOWED to cheat. I'm a STARSHIP. * =========================================
Grey Area Caldari	Posted - 2005.11.12 16:09:00 - [6] This is a crosspost from another thread...corssposting is baad, m'kay? But in this case I think it needs to be seen here. I've added a bit more info, so it's not just a plain copy/paste job. Originally by: Liu Kaskakka Everyone has drone interfacing lvl 5 already anyway so it doesn't matter. Originally by: Weirda not saying its not a nerf... but why 'raven'? Let me explain. The old Drone Interfacing skill allowed you to control one extra drone from the top end of "drones" skill...so increasing it from 5 through to ten. The drone bay on most non-Gallente ships will hold SIX heavy drones. As Heavies are pound for pound better than anything smaller, most non-Gallente just train DI to level 1...that gives you enough to control all 6 heavy drones. Training it any higher is pointless as you can't carry any more drones than that. So firstly, assuming an equal spread of the four races, I would guess only 25% have DI to anything like level 5. Secondly, since the missile patch, use of drones is more essential to a Raven pilot than it is to an Apoc or Tempest pilot...let me back this up. First, turrets have no travel time. So against a small target, they hit as soon as it is locked. To travel 100km, Cruise takes 12 seconds, Torps nearly 20, and ROF is about 8 seconds in the best case. An Interceptor doing 4000m/s has closed the distance down to less than 50km in that space of time, so the Raven pilot gets in maybe TWO volleys before the Interceptor is on top of him...the volleys are effectively fixed damage (and work out to about 40 points per missile BEFORE resistances are applied). This basically means the Interceptor arrives at the Raven almost 100% intact...which means the drones have to do all the work taking him down. Now a Turret BS...first off the Interceptor pilot has a choice...go straight in and get hit, or keep transversal high and not get hit (or at least, get hit a lot less). Most large guns will be able to get 5 or 6 volleys in EVEN IF THE INTERCEPTOR HEADS STRAIGHT IN. So the Interceptor pilot (if he knows his stuff) has to choose to be careful. Even then, the random nature of turrets, and careful timing (here's a hint, if you're in a Turret BS being approached by an Inty, use the "Look at" command to watch your target...opportunities for good shots arise...you'll figure it out) results in the Interceptor arriving at the target BS in a MORE damaged state, and at a later time than if it had approached a Raven...thus, less work for the drones to do. Also...The Apoc has eight turret slots, so the two turrets it has fitted will benefit from all the "generic" gunnery skills that the Apoc pilot undoubtedly has...surgical strike, Motion Prediction etc. The Tempest is a flat four:four ship, so doesn't favour any particular type of weapon (to be honest, I always felt sorry for the Minmatar about this). However, it DOES give the Minmatar pilot the option of fitting for smaller targets by putting on either small launchers or small turrets, according to whichever he is most skilled in. The Raven however, is a missile boat...however, it is a missile boat with only 6 missile slots, so Raven pilots are using turrets for close in defence which they likely have lower than average skills in. Admittedly, training a small turret skill up to level 5 is no big deal...but all the other "generic" gunnery skills are. So... Apoc pilot fits small energy weapons and benefits from generic gunnery skills Tempest pilot can fit either small guns or small launchers, depending in which skills he has more points. Raven pilot is forced to use small turrets in which he is likely to be low skilled. All of which forces even MORE of the work to be done on to the drones. Put simply, of all the non-Gallente BS, the Raven is the MOST reliant on its drones, and that is why we regard this as another Raven nerf. I hope that's cleared things up. --- I don't mind you disagreeing with me. Just don't say I don't have the SKILLS to comment.
Grey Area	Posted - 2005.11.14 00:47:00 - [7] Apologies if this has been considered, but why is it that the only limit on the number of drones a player can launch is either; 1. Drone bay size 2. Player skill level Why not have a ship setting similar to the "max no of targets" but instead "max no of drones"? This would allow for some ships to have a drone bay only large enough for a single launch of drones, whilst others, who perhaps could STILL control only two or three, would be able to hold "reserves" for subsequent launches? Domi would of course have max no of drones at 5...Apoc and Raven both at three, but in view of the Raven relying more heavily on it's drones, let it be able to carry FOUR, so that it has a spare load, or at least a choice of launch (two damagers, or two webbers) It would add a lot more variety. Another way to do it...leave things as they are currently, but give some ships a "reserve drone bay". Drones cannot be launched from it, only moved to the actual drone bay (and only when there is a "vacancy" in terms of both drones IN the bay AND in space). ========================================= * I'm ALLOWED to cheat. I'm a STARSHIP. * =========================================
Grey Area Caldari	Posted - 2005.11.14 00:47:00 - [8] Apologies if this has been considered, but why is it that the only limit on the number of drones a player can launch is either; 1. Drone bay size 2. Player skill level Why not have a ship setting similar to the "max no of targets" but instead "max no of drones"? This would allow for some ships to have a drone bay only large enough for a single launch of drones, whilst others, who perhaps could STILL control only two or three, would be able to hold "reserves" for subsequent launches? Domi would of course have max no of drones at 5...Apoc and Raven both at three, but in view of the Raven relying more heavily on it's drones, let it be able to carry FOUR, so that it has a spare load, or at least a choice of launch (two damagers, or two webbers) It would add a lot more variety. Another way to do it...leave things as they are currently, but give some ships a "reserve drone bay". Drones cannot be launched from it, only moved to the actual drone bay (and only when there is a "vacancy" in terms of both drones IN the bay AND in space). --- I don't mind you disagreeing with me. Just don't say I don't have the SKILLS to comment.
Grey Area	Posted - 2005.11.14 08:33:00 - [9] Well, I'm glad you like it Ith. (see I don't just whine about missiles for a living!) I just thought it would give a greater level of variation to ships...yes I would also apply the changes to smaller ships, not just BS's. With the new drones, even the capacity to launch ONE drone (a webber say) would be an advantage (it's questionable that one fighter drone is worth having). If you then add in that some ships will only be able to EVER launch one drone, but others could launch one, and if it was shot down, replace it with another, and do that up to (say) 5 times...then there is more to choose from on the ship front. A question...would people want it to be possible to move drones BACK into the reserve drone bay? Obviously it would mean leaving sufficient space for them. Or would that make the presence of the reserve bay too imbalancing compared to ships without one - should it be a "one way" transfer from reserve to main only? ========================================= * I'm ALLOWED to cheat. I'm a STARSHIP. * =========================================
Grey Area Caldari	Posted - 2005.11.14 08:33:00 - [10] Well, I'm glad you like it Ith. (see I don't just whine about missiles for a living!) I just thought it would give a greater level of variation to ships...yes I would also apply the changes to smaller ships, not just BS's. With the new drones, even the capacity to launch ONE drone (a webber say) would be an advantage (it's questionable that one fighter drone is worth having). If you then add in that some ships will only be able to EVER launch one drone, but others could launch one, and if it was shot down, replace it with another, and do that up to (say) 5 times...then there is more to choose from on the ship front. A question...would people want it to be possible to move drones BACK into the reserve drone bay? Obviously it would mean leaving sufficient space for them. Or would that make the presence of the reserve bay too imbalancing compared to ships without one - should it be a "one way" transfer from reserve to main only? --- I don't mind you disagreeing with me. Just don't say I don't have the SKILLS to comment.

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